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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niko_Kovač Also, Niko Kovac is J2b L283 and on the PH1602 branch. Niko and brother, Robert Kovac:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lubomirski The Lubomirski Family in Poland belong to J2b L283, specifically PH1602 branch. Alexi and his dad Ladislas Lubomirski are close matches of mine. 5/67 markers. My paternal roots are in the Beskid Mountains in southern Poland.

Agreed, I don’t think it originated there but may have spread there from either Central Europe or across the Adriatic from the Balkans. The German publication mentioned claims the Lubomirski family descends from Aurelius Drusus. I have no idea who that was. When I google that name, I get...

Lubomirski Family in Poland is J2b2 PH1602. It’s possible they MAY have migrated there from Rome long ago, at least based on this German historical account referenced above. Curious if any L283, specifically PH1602, shows up in this upcoming Moots study.

Very interesting. That has to be close to where that almost 4000 year old J2b2 L283 CTS3617 was discovered several years ago.

I think he was one of the first on the branch on the YFull Tree. He has the Bosnian flag. Is he Bosnian or Croatian? I know Flor has mentioned that it looks like PH1602 comes from Croatia or an area north of Albania (Lots of L283 amongst Albanians, but no PH1602 found yet). There are some...

Any theories about this branch’s spread throughout Europe? My understanding is that DYS456=12 =PH1602. Looking at the M241 Project, most of the samples that have DYS456=12 have not done Big Y or SNP testing, so they have not been labeled PH1602. In the M241 project under L283, there are...

Looking forward to the eventual release of the paper (can’t believe there are 28 pages worth of posts regarding a paper that is yet to be released). In my case, I come from a Polish family with a well established history in Poland dating back over 1,000 years, but it’s rumored that our Y line...

Excellent analysis. I enjoyed reading this post. There are many PH1602 individuals (DYS 456=12 as you’ve mentioned) who are yet to be grouped in the M241 project page. Looking forward to theories regarding this particular branch of J2b2 L283.

I don’t know what the typical autosomal profile is for a Tosk Albanian, but I would not expect such a high percentage of Aegean. J2a L24 plus Aegean and Tuscan autosomal point to Mediterranean origins, possibly southern Greece. Just my guess.

There are also additional branches downstream from L24.

You’re correct, it’s a separate branch from J2b2 L283, so J2a. Goes back at least 16000 years. I see no Greek flags on the L24 YFull tree, but flags from much of Europe and southwest Asia. I don’t believe it’s typical for the Greek population, but I recall J2a becoming more frequent among...

But do we really KNOW that the Sardinian was Z585? Could he belong to a branch further downstream? Did he have any Yamnaya ancestry? Or did he have an autosomal ancestry consistent with Phoenician ancestry? Looking at YFull, every one of today’s members of Z585 is an Italian.

The L283 sample(s) found in Sardinia were from the Nuragic era which saw the arrival of the Bonannaro culture in Sardinia. The Bonannaro culture was from northern Italy/Central Europe. So the L283 in Sardinia likely came from continental Europe.

That’s very interesting. My only very close match is a prominent member of the Lubomirski noble family from Poland. We’re J2b2 L283, specifically PH1602. I’m wondering if that could have come from Sarmatia.